Peter M. Fasolo, former CHRO at Johnson & Johnson, shares key leadership insights on the future of HR, high-performance work systems, and his machine learning in HR strategy in this Strategic CHRO interview with Adam Bryant of The ExCo Group and World 50 Group as part of the series “Passing the Baton.”
Q. What are the X-factor skills and capabilities that the next generation of CHROs is going to need?
A. The role of the HR chief—in the eyes of the CEO, the board and P&L leaders—has to be defined by whether they are helping drive business outcomes with a focus on value creation. Moving forward, the HR chief has to be able to continuously demonstrate that the work they do is creating high-performance work systems and bringing in new capabilities that are linked to the outcomes that P&L leaders and boards and CEOs care deeply about. Rather than starting with our own set of practices, you have to start from the outside in.
And the role is not only about helping to drive those hard business outcomes. What else do CEOs and boards care about? You’ve got to demonstrate that the general health of your organization is vibrant. That shows up in reputation, retention of key employees, and where value is being created. Are you bringing in new capabilities like AI and machine learning? Are you upskilling people so that they can remain relevant and compete in today’s world?
Q. It takes a certain background and wiring to be comfortable amid all this ambiguity. Where does that come from for you?
A. You have to have a real appreciation for the organization as a system—an integrated set of levers that need to work together to make a difference for your customers, or patients in our case. You have to be a curious and interested practitioner on how things work in large-scale social systems, and not just in terms of separate responsibilities like hiring, leadership, and compensation. I’ve always been curious about how you lead an entity forward through its people. You’ve got to be curious about the subject matter in a more integrated manner.
Second, you’ve got to care deeply about your associates and your leaders, and you have to care deeply about helping them to be even more effective in what they do. You are a supporting actor in that quest, and you’ve got to be comfortable in the role of advisor. You have to set aside your ego, and be comfortable providing your perspective and allowing others to either accept that counsel or make it better. I’ve always been curious about human capital. I’ve always wanted to try to help people be the best representation of themselves. And you’ve got to be interested and excellent at teaching and sharing your perspective. My professional training is in psychology, and I could have gone into academia with my Ph.D. But I was really curious about the psychology of organizational behavior. How do you help people play to their strengths and really engage them to find their best selves?
Q. What do you consider the hardest part of leadership?
A. You need to slow yourself down and have the discipline to be less busy with activities and more focused on the few things that matter. And you also have to be able to provide a perspective on so many different issues. Leaders need different angles on problems, and you’ve got to be able to share your perspectives. If you can’t do that, you can’t lead. In leadership positions at the top of big organizations, you must be able to teach, slow down and provide your perspective.
Q. What are the do’s and don’ts you would share with a CHRO who is stepping into the role for the first time?
A. People will remember you more for how you did what you did—particularly by focusing on helping people grow—than what you did. Did you provide an environment that was trusting? A big part of trust is whether you consistently do what you say you are going to do. Once you establish that environment of trust, then you can keep raising the bar. If people worry about whether you’ll have their back, you’re never going to be able to raise the bar. It has to start with trust and care, and then you can keep pushing and learning and get 10 to 15 percent better every year.
Q. Was there anything about the job itself that was different from what you expected before you sat in the chair?
A. I didn’t quite appreciate how much learning and curiosity and agility you need to solve the big problems that you face every day in this role. You are coaching people individually through sticky situations, and then maybe dealing the next minute with a crisis, or an acquisition or divestiture that isn’t playing out as expected. You’ve got to be really open to learning and knowing how to solve issues.
And you’ve got to be really good at aligning your set of issues with the direction of the corporation and staying on point, because many people or teams or stakeholders will try to take you off your agenda. You’ve got to stay anchored on the few things that matter. You have to know what’s important and what’s not, and be comfortable letting those things roll off your to-do list. You don’t need to chase down everything. You’ve got to be right in the right places and not be right in the wrong places.
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